Dead RN1-Help please

Hitec robotics including ROBONOVA humanoid, HSR-8498HB servos, MR C-3024 Controllers and RoboBasic
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35 postsPage 2 of 31, 2, 3

Post by i-Bot » Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:19 am

Post by i-Bot
Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:19 am

If the standard software is loaded, then the tones should sound on power on even without remote

Did you try removing servo leads ? Also check no shorts under the board. Sometimes if there are wires under the board, then solder connections may puncture them. The board should give tones and also be connectable from the PC with just the board and battery.
If the standard software is loaded, then the tones should sound on power on even without remote

Did you try removing servo leads ? Also check no shorts under the board. Sometimes if there are wires under the board, then solder connections may puncture them. The board should give tones and also be connectable from the PC with just the board and battery.
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Post by old_goat » Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:31 pm

Post by old_goat
Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:31 pm

i removed all the servo leads, and the board itself, still get nothing, no tones at all.seems to me that the board is faultly.

just put the voltmeter back on the board and I am getting 6.96 Volts at the battery connector, but only 1.65 v at the servos. weird.
i removed all the servo leads, and the board itself, still get nothing, no tones at all.seems to me that the board is faultly.

just put the voltmeter back on the board and I am getting 6.96 Volts at the battery connector, but only 1.65 v at the servos. weird.
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Post by ozfiddler » Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:43 pm

Post by ozfiddler
Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:43 pm

Hi old_goat,

I'm in Australia but Sydney area (Blue Mountains actually). I think I saw the Robo on ebay that you bought. Can't understand how he would have had it working before listing if it was supplied without IR sensor installed.

Anyway, I can't really be of any more help unfortunately. If i-Bot can't help you then no-one can!
Hi old_goat,

I'm in Australia but Sydney area (Blue Mountains actually). I think I saw the Robo on ebay that you bought. Can't understand how he would have had it working before listing if it was supplied without IR sensor installed.

Anyway, I can't really be of any more help unfortunately. If i-Bot can't help you then no-one can!
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Post by ozfiddler » Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:45 pm

Post by ozfiddler
Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:45 pm

What voltage are you getting on the top row pins?
What voltage are you getting on the top row pins?
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Post by old_goat » Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:10 am

Post by old_goat
Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:10 am

I am getting 1.65 v on the top row. but I was sure I was getting 5v the other day. oh and the battery has been freshly charged.
thanks for you support ozfiddler

UPDATE.
I plugged the board into my lab power supply and I am now getting 4.96v on the top row of pins, but com port still doesn't work. is it time to get a new board ?
I am getting 1.65 v on the top row. but I was sure I was getting 5v the other day. oh and the battery has been freshly charged.
thanks for you support ozfiddler

UPDATE.
I plugged the board into my lab power supply and I am now getting 4.96v on the top row of pins, but com port still doesn't work. is it time to get a new board ?
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Post by ozfiddler » Fri Jan 14, 2011 2:54 am

Post by ozfiddler
Fri Jan 14, 2011 2:54 am

A new board isn't cheap! About 170 pounds. It's strange about the different voltages from battery and lab power supply though. Maybe i-Bot will have some more ideas for testing.
A new board isn't cheap! About 170 pounds. It's strange about the different voltages from battery and lab power supply though. Maybe i-Bot will have some more ideas for testing.
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Post by old_goat » Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:17 am

Post by old_goat
Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:17 am

$170 POUNDS wow that's expensive !!
yeah I don't understand the voltage variation either. I just checked again and now I am getting 4.97 at the top pins, and 6.8v on the servo pins when connected to the BATTERY, just weird.

Maybe i-Bot will have some more ideas for testing>>
I hope so, I am willing to try anything.

this what i think has happened, the controller board has a problem with the serial port, but otherwise is OK. this would explain me not being able to access it via PC. If I plug a spare servo into any of the active connections, the servo immediately starts up, so i know there is enough power.

the IR reciever unit could be damaged (it has been re-soldered and looks pretty bad) or I need to reset the remote controller somehow after putting new batteries in it. this would explain why nothing happens when I use the remote. I did test the remote control, by using my iphone camera whilst pressing it's buttons and I was getting a flashing light, so I am assuming it is working.
$170 POUNDS wow that's expensive !!
yeah I don't understand the voltage variation either. I just checked again and now I am getting 4.97 at the top pins, and 6.8v on the servo pins when connected to the BATTERY, just weird.

Maybe i-Bot will have some more ideas for testing>>
I hope so, I am willing to try anything.

this what i think has happened, the controller board has a problem with the serial port, but otherwise is OK. this would explain me not being able to access it via PC. If I plug a spare servo into any of the active connections, the servo immediately starts up, so i know there is enough power.

the IR reciever unit could be damaged (it has been re-soldered and looks pretty bad) or I need to reset the remote controller somehow after putting new batteries in it. this would explain why nothing happens when I use the remote. I did test the remote control, by using my iphone camera whilst pressing it's buttons and I was getting a flashing light, so I am assuming it is working.
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Post by ozfiddler » Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:10 am

Post by ozfiddler
Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:10 am

Hmmm... if there is a problem with the serial port connection then it is tricky because you can't try other program options that might bypass the remote control.

Did you say the IR receiver is resoldered and looks pretty bad? I think I'd be taking this up with your seller and possibly registering a complaint with ebay - I really can't see how he tested it as working before he sold it.
Hmmm... if there is a problem with the serial port connection then it is tricky because you can't try other program options that might bypass the remote control.

Did you say the IR receiver is resoldered and looks pretty bad? I think I'd be taking this up with your seller and possibly registering a complaint with ebay - I really can't see how he tested it as working before he sold it.
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Post by i-Bot » Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:24 am

Post by i-Bot
Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:24 am

The schematic of the C3024 is here:
http://robosavvy.com/Builders/i-Bot/c3024.pdf
You will see the only thing between the battery and the servo power pins is the switch. You need to be confident of the power first. Check the switch or battery are not intermittent.

The usual problems on the serial port are either related to the PC/USB or a broken jack serial connector.

To run the serial connection all that is needed is good power, crystal, serial and processor. Running robot code needs the eeprom too.

If you connect to the C3024 serial port with a terminal program (hyperterminal) at 9600 baud you should see a ">" character when you turn the power on. This from the bootloader in the processor.
The schematic of the C3024 is here:
http://robosavvy.com/Builders/i-Bot/c3024.pdf
You will see the only thing between the battery and the servo power pins is the switch. You need to be confident of the power first. Check the switch or battery are not intermittent.

The usual problems on the serial port are either related to the PC/USB or a broken jack serial connector.

To run the serial connection all that is needed is good power, crystal, serial and processor. Running robot code needs the eeprom too.

If you connect to the C3024 serial port with a terminal program (hyperterminal) at 9600 baud you should see a ">" character when you turn the power on. This from the bootloader in the processor.
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Post by i-Bot » Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:49 am

Post by i-Bot
Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:49 am

I just saw this:
http://www.acroname.com/robotics/parts/H3-MR-C3024.html

Seems to be later version than either of my C3024 and has a polyfuse at the bottom left corner. This is not in my schematic and likely sits in the power path. Does yours have this ?[/url]
I just saw this:
http://www.acroname.com/robotics/parts/H3-MR-C3024.html

Seems to be later version than either of my C3024 and has a polyfuse at the bottom left corner. This is not in my schematic and likely sits in the power path. Does yours have this ?[/url]
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Post by old_goat » Sat Jan 15, 2011 3:43 am

Post by old_goat
Sat Jan 15, 2011 3:43 am

nope, mine doesn't have the polyfuse.
regarding the IR, can I use something else as the receiving unit eg Sharp IR sensor as a replacement ? or is ther a way to check if it is working.

this is how the receiver looked when i got it:
http://www.melbournestarriders.com/ir.jpg

I do not get a response in hyperterminal, nothing at all in the box.

oh and once again thanks guys for help.
nope, mine doesn't have the polyfuse.
regarding the IR, can I use something else as the receiving unit eg Sharp IR sensor as a replacement ? or is ther a way to check if it is working.

this is how the receiver looked when i got it:
http://www.melbournestarriders.com/ir.jpg

I do not get a response in hyperterminal, nothing at all in the box.

oh and once again thanks guys for help.
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Post by ozfiddler » Sat Jan 15, 2011 5:46 am

Post by ozfiddler
Sat Jan 15, 2011 5:46 am

This is how it should look. I wonder if it is worth trying to clean it up and remove the resistors? But it certainly looks like someone has been playing around with it so who knows how much other damage they have done.

Image
This is how it should look. I wonder if it is worth trying to clean it up and remove the resistors? But it certainly looks like someone has been playing around with it so who knows how much other damage they have done.

Image
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Post by old_goat » Sat Jan 15, 2011 6:07 am

Post by old_goat
Sat Jan 15, 2011 6:07 am

I thoght about that , but I wasn't sure whether the resistors were meant to be there or not ?
I tried hooking up another receiver that I had but it didn't work, iam not sure what frequency the Robonova uses. my receiver was 38khz.
I thoght about that , but I wasn't sure whether the resistors were meant to be there or not ?
I tried hooking up another receiver that I had but it didn't work, iam not sure what frequency the Robonova uses. my receiver was 38khz.
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Post by ozfiddler » Sat Jan 15, 2011 9:00 am

Post by ozfiddler
Sat Jan 15, 2011 9:00 am

My Robo came already assembled so I haven't seen it. Maybe someone else can tell you how it should look, and if the resistors should be there. Doesn't look right to me but I'm certainly no expert (and I'm away from home so can't check at the moment).

I think the most important thing is to get the serial communication working. If you want to do anything with other sensors or other control methods then you will need to be able to load in a revised program. If (and it's a big IF) you can trust the seller and it has the original software loaded then the IR should be able to work and get some response.

Actually I'd be interested to know how hard it is to fry one of these boards. I've had a few times when I was very worried that I'd done some serious damage but I-Bot came to the rescue. I'm not sure though when or how easily you can permanently wreck the C3024.
My Robo came already assembled so I haven't seen it. Maybe someone else can tell you how it should look, and if the resistors should be there. Doesn't look right to me but I'm certainly no expert (and I'm away from home so can't check at the moment).

I think the most important thing is to get the serial communication working. If you want to do anything with other sensors or other control methods then you will need to be able to load in a revised program. If (and it's a big IF) you can trust the seller and it has the original software loaded then the IR should be able to work and get some response.

Actually I'd be interested to know how hard it is to fry one of these boards. I've had a few times when I was very worried that I'd done some serious damage but I-Bot came to the rescue. I'm not sure though when or how easily you can permanently wreck the C3024.
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Post by i-Bot » Sat Jan 15, 2011 4:58 pm

Post by i-Bot
Sat Jan 15, 2011 4:58 pm

Normal construction of the IR sensor is not very pretty. There appears tp be a 1K resistor in series with the data output and a ceramic capacitor (similar to resitor but fatter) across the suply rails. I have used other standard 38KHz receivers without problem too.

The board has proven pretty resilient. Because it is so simple there is little to go wrong, however the many processor pins are naked to the outside world. A few boards have been pronouced dead if you look back over the forum.

If the power is OK. Then if a serial terminal program at 9600 echos back characters when the tip and ring of the jack connector are shorted, but you do not see a "> " when you power up the board, you likely have a broke board.

I don't know what the support/distributor situation is in Oz. Hitec and Multiplex in US and Germany have been very good at fixing stuff for free. Try them first. If not working send me a private message and we will see what else we can do to fix.
Normal construction of the IR sensor is not very pretty. There appears tp be a 1K resistor in series with the data output and a ceramic capacitor (similar to resitor but fatter) across the suply rails. I have used other standard 38KHz receivers without problem too.

The board has proven pretty resilient. Because it is so simple there is little to go wrong, however the many processor pins are naked to the outside world. A few boards have been pronouced dead if you look back over the forum.

If the power is OK. Then if a serial terminal program at 9600 echos back characters when the tip and ring of the jack connector are shorted, but you do not see a "> " when you power up the board, you likely have a broke board.

I don't know what the support/distributor situation is in Oz. Hitec and Multiplex in US and Germany have been very good at fixing stuff for free. Try them first. If not working send me a private message and we will see what else we can do to fix.
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